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Hi,
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">the Rivet routines work perfectly fine with the Herwig shower (!) — it’s just Fortran Herwig that doesn’t comply with the HepMC standard, for which the routines might not work. All the more reason to move to the modern incarnations of Herwig...</div>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">Cheers,</div>
<div class="">Chris</div>
<div class=""><br class="">
<div>
<blockquote type="cite" class="">
<div class="">On 25 Jan 2017, at 17:31, Dominic Hirschbuehl <<a href="mailto:dhirsch@mail.cern.ch" class="">dhirsch@mail.cern.ch</a>> wrote:</div>
<br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
<div class=""><span style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">Hi
Andy,</span><br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
<br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
<span style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">thanks
a lot for the quick answer.</span><br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
<span style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">It
is indeed Fortran Herwig and I ran over a MC12 sample. Maybe the</span><br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
<span style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">rewriter
was not used for this sample.</span><br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
<br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
<span style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">However,
does this mean, that we need to put some disclaimer to our</span><br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
<span style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">Rivet
routines, that they don't work for the Herwig shower, since</span><br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
<span style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">everybody
outside ATLAS won't have the rewriter, right?</span><br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
<br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
<span style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">Cheers</span><br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
<span style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline !important;" class=""> Dominic</span><br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
<br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
<span style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">On
Wed, Jan 25, 2017 at 05:24:21PM +0000, Andy Buckley wrote:</span><br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
<blockquote type="cite" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
Hi Dominic,<br class="">
<br class="">
Is this *Fortran* Herwig?<br class="">
<br class="">
Indeed it uses non-standard status codes, so Rivet's algorithms will<br class="">
break. But in ATLAS we added a Herwig status rewriter, to make it<br class="">
compliant -- is that not being used in your sample?<br class="">
<br class="">
The restriction to look at status 2 only (because status 1 can't be<br class="">
an ancestor) is maybe a bit extreme: we could also allow status<br class="">
codes > 10 to be used (the MC range if I remember correctly). But<br class="">
then we wouldn't know what sort of generator-dependence we'd be<br class="">
introducing: for example Herwig++ uses status 11 for everything that<br class="">
isn't 1, 2, or 4 so we could end up walking up precisely the sort of<br class="">
unphysical debug trees that the code is trying to avoid...<br class="">
<br class="">
Short answer: the generator needs to be compliant with the HepMC<br class="">
status scheme. But I thought we had already modified FHerwig in that<br class="">
way.<br class="">
<br class="">
Andy<br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
On 25/01/17 16:55, Dominic Hirschbuehl wrote:<br class="">
<blockquote type="cite" class="">Dear all,<br class="">
<br class="">
I have a question concerning the PromptFinalState projection.<br class="">
I did a study on acceptences of lep+jets ttbar events, where I found an<br class="">
unexpected differences between Powheg+Pythia6 and Powheg+Herwig samples.<br class="">
The differences occured already on the level of the lepton acceptance,<br class="">
which includes a dilepton veto.<br class="">
<br class="">
After some investigation I have the suspicion, that leptons from hadron<br class="">
decays are counted as prompt leptons.<br class="">
<br class="">
Looking to the actual implementation of isPrompt I found this line of code:<br class="">
if (ancestor->status() != 2) continue; // no non-standard statuses or<br class="">
beams to be used in decision making<br class="">
<br class="">
Is there a reason to restrict the status codes to 2?<br class="">
If I print out all ancestors of a "prompt lepton" from a Herwig showered event<br class="">
I get:<br class="">
<br class="">
pdg = 2212 status = 101 0 1<br class="">
pdg = 2212 status = 102 0 1<br class="">
pdg = 21 status = 121 1 0<br class="">
pdg = 21 status = 122 1 0<br class="">
pdg = 6 status = 123 1 0<br class="">
pdg = 6 status = 143 1 0<br class="">
pdg = 6 status = 3 1 0<br class="">
pdg = 6 status = 155 1 0<br class="">
pdg = 24 status = 123 0 0<br class="">
pdg = 24 status = 3 0 0<br class="">
pdg = 24 status = 155 0 0<br class="">
pdg = 4 status = 124 1 0<br class="">
pdg = 4 status = 144 1 0<br class="">
pdg = 4 status = 2 1 0<br class="">
pdg = 21 status = 2 1 0<br class="">
pdg = 4 status = 158 1 0<br class="">
pdg = -2 status = 158 1 0<br class="">
pdg = 91 status = 183 0 0<br class="">
pdg = 411 status = 197 0 1<br class="">
<br class="">
which would indicate that the identified lepton actually comes fomr a<br class="">
hadron.<br class="">
<br class="">
Do I miss something?<br class="">
<br class="">
Thanks in advance<br class="">
Dominic<br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
_______________________________________________<br class="">
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<a href="mailto:Rivet@projects.hepforge.org" class="">Rivet@projects.hepforge.org</a><br class="">
https://www.hepforge.org/lists/listinfo/rivet<br class="">
<br class="">
</blockquote>
<br class="">
<br class="">
--<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">
Dr Andy Buckley, Lecturer / Royal Society University Research Fellow<br class="">
Particle Physics Expt Group, University of Glasgow<br class="">
</blockquote>
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Dr. Christian Gütschow</div>
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Department of Physics and Astronomy</div>
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University College London</div>
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Gower Street</div>
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London WC1E 6BT</div>
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> D10 Physics Building</div>
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> +44 (0)20 7679 3775</div>
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> <a href="mailto:chris.g@cern.ch" class="">chris.g@cern.ch</a></div>
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